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MPS are preparing to debate a motion

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calling for an inquiry into the

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government's handling of the Iraq War

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and its aftermath we joining us now one

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of those MPS the respect parties's MP

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George Galloway Mr Galloway thank you

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very much indeed for joining us today uh

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sitting in that chair well an hour or so

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ago Dennis McShan was saying we don't

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need another inquiry we've had inquiries

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already all another inquiry would do is

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secure lots of cheap political points

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scoring what do you think of that well

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in the famous words of manday rice Davis

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he would say that wouldn't he because

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he's one of the people whose conduct

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would have to be investigated the entire

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government is jointly and severally

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responsible for a disaster a military

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disaster of the kind suffered by

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Napoleon at Moscow and uh and Hitler in

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uh operation Barbarosa when he attacked

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the Soviet Union a political disaster

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the worst political disaster our country

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has uh suffered for probably 100 years

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since the boore war and with much more

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significance so the stakes are very high

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for people like Dennis mcshain to try

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and cover their tracks until they can

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get out of office uh unack as it were is

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but isn't the great problem and and

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people will appreciate that sweep of

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History which you've just given us but

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one of the defining characteristics of

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those battles that you mentioned those

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debar that you mentioned is that we've

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had time to assess whether they did

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anything good or did anything bad and

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the problem here is and you had one

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writing about this over the weekend that

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you can look at something like the

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Malayan emergency and recognize that it

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took something like a decade for the

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Brits to get themselves together to get

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organized enough to learn how to deal

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with an Insurgency it's only 3 or four

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years three and a half years since March

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2003 the Americans will say look we've

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had successful elections 60% of Iraqis

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turned out and voted that's as good as

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say British general election there are

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nightmarish scenes admittedly but some

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in some areas it's going better than

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some Ed I'm not sure what areas those

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would be if I could go through a couple

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if you like yes well for instance um

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Sadam was saying when he used to be in

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charge there were there were no free

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television channels now 60% of Iraqis

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have got satellite television you might

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not think that's a good thing but

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they've got a free press now for

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instance they've got free elections

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nobody's saying that things are life is

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good in Iraq far from it but it's wrong

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surely to paint the picture as

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completely Bleak but

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655,000 Iraqis have been killed

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according to one report well according

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to the John's Hopkins University one of

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the most respected universities in the

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United States of America and the Lancet

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one of the most respected journals in

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Britain you could take your pick whether

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to believe Mr Blair's denial or John's

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Hopkins and the Lan most people would

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choose the latter I can assure you about

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that thousands of our own soldiers

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American and British have been killed

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tens of thousands have been wounded and

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maimed and our own soldiers are telling

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you including the top Soldier is telling

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you that our presence in Iraq is

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exacerbating the situation we should get

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out soon and that uh it has undoubtedly

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contributed to uh a reality of danger

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for British people and British interests

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around the world and that's the

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difference between uh this and the

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Malayan emergency for example first of

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all there were not more than half a

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million people dead in the Malayan

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emergency and secondly it did not have

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the international ramifications which

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This Disaster had has had it spread

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extremism fanaticism hatred and

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bitterness throughout the Muslim World

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which is 1.7 billion strong and which

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has 2 million uh adherence in our own

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country that division that bitterness

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has led to a situation where many people

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are out to hurt us and out to damage us

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and the consequences of our grave nobody

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would deny elements of your analysis for

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sure but let's just talk specifically

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about the debate that we're going to see

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in the Commons today Adam Price he's ped

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C's defense spokesman he wrote in a

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newspaper or was quoted in a newspaper

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this morning as saying it's essential

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for The credibility of our democracy

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that we establish what combination of

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deception delusion and inaptitude

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carried us down this fateful path I

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suspect you may well agree with those

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words but that's not the point well let

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me just finish the question which is

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that no government's going to set up an

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inquiry an impartial balanced inquiry

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where the firing squad according to Mr

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Price were already lined up well you say

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that but the House of Commons once cl to

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the challenge

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and in the Norway in the Norway debate

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when after 3 days uh people put the

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country before the party the war effort

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before the interests of the Prime

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Minister Chamberlain was sacked uh

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Churchill was installed all as a result

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of a House of Commons debate and vote

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and the whole history of the world was

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changed I would not be here today if

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that had not been done somebody else

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would be here and you'd be speaking in

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German and I'd be replying in German

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that's how important the stakes were on

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that day and the House of Commons Rose

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to that now whether we have a parliament

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today that would do that uh must be in

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very great doubt and I'm not predicting

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to you that the prime minister is going

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to lose the vote but he's definitely

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lost the argument and I suspect that you

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know that most people in the country now

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agree with me and that everything I said

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about Iraq before the war has turned out

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to be right and everything that Mr Blair

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said about the war before it turned out

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to be wrong except where it was

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deliberately a lie I I don't know if you

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can reach into your trouser pocket and

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switch off your mobile phone if you've

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got one it could be channel four trying

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to get through to you about a who knows

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a new offer of a reality show who there

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you go um there are those who will say

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what possible good would a public inqu

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any kind of inquiry frankly achieve

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because the Americans recognize they

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made mistakes but they made them and

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again this is what some people will say

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they made them in good faith they sought

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to adopt a model that they adopted after

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the second world World War Den

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nification they tried to strip out every

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trace of baptism now we can all say that

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was a disaster because of course that

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meant dismantling the police force the

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security apparatus the Army things that

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ought to have been kept in place but

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it's done it's happened it's gone what's

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the good of pouring over the Embers now

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when what many people need in Iraq is as

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much support from the West

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psychologically as well as militarily

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and financially as they possibly can

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muster well some might say that Mr Bush

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acted in good faith but not many and not

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many in the United States as you're

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going to find out in 7 Days time where

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the Republican Party looks set to be on

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the end of the mother of all electoral

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beatings so not many people accept that

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the Bush Administration acted in good

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faith not many even in the Republican

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party anymore and Mr Blair continues to

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stand on that Wicket but he has fewer

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and fewer supporters less and less

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enthusiastically the reality is we

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should never have invaded and occupied

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Iran

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the basis for doing so was wholly wrong

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except where it was deliberately

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fraudulent there were no weapons of mass

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destruction there was no link to

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Al-Qaeda there was no connection to the

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atrocity on 911 the world has not been

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made safer terrorism has multiplied

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rather than been uh squashed everything

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that was predicted about the war by the

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anti-war movement has turned out to be

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right it's time to have an inquiry to

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establish how such a gigantic blunder

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would was made not just because we need

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to change course on this but because we

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have to avoid such a thing ever

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happening again it's not asking too much

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is it a seven man inquiry uh of privy

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counselors to look at the blunders of

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the worst policy disaster in a 100 years

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it's not asking for very much let me

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tell you somebody who's already made up

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their mind without an inquiry that's the

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veteran correspondent from the Middle

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East Robert Fisk we had him here a

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couple of weeks ago and he was saying so

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far as he could tell he'd reached the

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Bleak assessment many Iraqis and you

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know Iraq well had decided that they

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would actually prefer security and

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dictatorship rather than freedom and

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Anarchy now rightly or wrongly and I'm

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merely reading comments that have been

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reported in the past you have lavished

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allegedly blandishments on saddam's

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regime would you would do you think life

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would be better now under that

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dictatorship under that totalitarian

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regime of Terror run by Saddam Hussein

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well I have never lavished blandishments

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on Saddam Hussein's regime in fact I was

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one of the very few opponents of the

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Saddam Hussein regime when British

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ministers and business when British

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businessmen and and and ministers were

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going in and out of the Iraqi Embassy

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doing business with them so I'm sorry I

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just won't have that well it's you don't

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need

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to point the more important point is

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whether or not Iraqis were better off

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before the war than they are now only a

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Madman would say that they're better off

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now for a start 655,000 of them are no

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longer here thousands and thousands

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thousand and thousands of them are in

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prison camps God knows where bodies are

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turning up 150 a day in the Mory with

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their tongues cut out and drill marks

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through their head nobody can walk

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safely on any Street in Iraq Millions

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have fled the country the Americans have

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looted billions of dollars worth of

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Iraq's wealth the idea that Iraq is

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better off today than it was before the

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war is simply absurd so you would prefer

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Iraq still to have I is it it's a simple

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question yes or that's not the choice

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you see that's not the choice that's not

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the choice the idea that Iraq is better

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off because of what bus and Blair did is

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simply absurd it's you only have to look

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at your own news broadcasts to see how

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stupid a statement that is it's not a

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statement it's a question it's a

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reasonable question and it's it's long

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we put to Rob you're the last people

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asking it nobody else in the world is

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asking it everybody knows this war is a

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bloody disaster why don't you just

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accept it because your station though

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admittedly not as bad as the BBC was an

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essential component of this invasion you

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regurgitated endlessly the propaganda

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I've got the videos if you want me to

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show you them endlessly regurgitated the

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propaganda and talked the country into

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its worst disaster for 100 years so have

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some humility and accept that you were

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wrong it's not a question of humility Mr

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Gallow it's a question of simply asking

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simple questions I think most of our

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viewers would have appreciated a

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straightforward yes or thank you very

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much indeed for your time interesting as

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ever talking to you George Galloway in

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central London thank you